Multiplayer Suggestion - Team Battle

Faffywaffy

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#1
Greetings to developers and players alike.

I've thoroughly enjoyed playing Terratech thus far, but the biggest thing missing from the game (in my opinion) is a good PVP gamemode. Deathmatch is fun the first couple of times, but having to build your techs on the fly is pretty stressful and doesn't result in any creative or optimized builds (It's a miracle if you can make a working plane.) Judging by the utter lack of deathmatch servers, I assume the rest of the playerbase feels the same way. On the flipside, I see plenty of multiplayer creative servers being set up just so the host can challenge whoever joins.

Now, here's how I feel it should work. I borrowed a lot of these ideas from MrTwister's thread.
- Teams will spawn on opposite sides of a map. It can either be pre-generated or created by the developers if they insist. The latter is preferable as it would have proper cover, obstacles only some techs can overcome, chokepoints, ect.
- An altitude ceiling for fliers.
- There will be no respawning. Teams fight until either side is completely destroyed.
- A time limit should be included to prevent hiding/stalling. Every player's location will be revealed when the limit is almost reached.
- Custom player techs. Players will choose a snapshot to spawn with as long as it fills the parameters set by the host and doesn't have any restricted parts.
- Build beam is disabled
- No downloaded techs or edits of downloaded techs. Players should be encouraged to design their own vehicles by all means.
The parameters can be set by the host, these include:
- Maximum $$BB value for each player in thousands. (Default value and minimum/maximum values are up to the developer)
- Tech Level limit for each corp that can be set individually. 1-5 for GSO, 1-3 for all the others. Maximum tech is default.
- Number of players (Or whatever the developers feel is appropriate)
- Map rotation.

Some other ideas include:
- One slot for a larger/more expensive tech for each team, similar to Robocraft's Megabots.
- More depth to radars, including unique radars for each cooperation with different functions, as well as radar jamming systems.
- Spotting Mechanics
- Some sort of weapon restrictions to prevent insane spam.

Enough with the boring lists. This gamemode will really push players to optimize their techs, and a real meta will start to develop. Constant attention and balancing is required to make sure there is lots of variety and the meta isn't one-dimensional. In the end, I think we'll end up with something really satisfying that will be a major selling point in the future.

I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts and suggestions.
 
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#2
I'm quite happy with this suggestion, except for two points.
Build beam is disabled
- No downloaded techs or edits of downloaded techs. Players should be encouraged to design their own vehicles by all means.
Build beam is very much needed, in case techs accidentally fall over from terrain/awkward physics. It won't provide any other advantage during battle, since it is automatically disabled when a tech is damaged. It might even be a disadvantage, since when you use it a giant luminous beam is projected into the air, revealing your location.

Some people may want to use techs built by others against friends. Restricting the game mode to non-downloaded techs/snapshotted techs would just encourage people to circumnavigate the rule by downloading the tech then snapshotting it in creative mode, which can make the game think it's an original tech. I also don't see any easy way to enforce the "no edited downloaded techs" rule.
 

Faffywaffy

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#3
There probably should be an alternate flipping mechanic of some sort, but I often see the build beam abused for other purposes. When attempting to outmaneuver and flank slower techs in MP creative, some players will use the build beam to orient their tech when they realize their steering isn't good enough. It gets even more abusive when you try to flank long-range artillery techs that have BS cannons or Cruise missiles and they can make a full 180 degree turn in less than a second. Of course, this is more problematic on large, open areas like the salt flats these battles take place in. The build beam also allows you to slowly but surely climb steep surfaces.

I have two ideas for restricting downloaded techs:
- Force the player to create the techs in a workshop where you cannot load anything. You can work on as many techs as you want and have them all saved in your workshop and edit them whenever, and you can even export them! but you cannot load things from snapshots.
- Create new code for snapshots so that they keep record of who the original creator was. This wouldn't work for old snapshots, but it's likely they weren't designed for this mode anyway since it doesn't exist yet.

I personally think that giving people the ability to download any powerful tech they want and never have to build a thing will ruin the entire gamemode. Essentially doing away with half of the game and arguably the most interesting aspect of it too. There's no way to stop people from loading the tech elsewhere and trying to memorize and copy it block-per-block, but most of the people that will want to download something from the workshop won't have the patience for that anyway, so it's a good deterrent.
 
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#4
There probably should be an alternate flipping mechanic of some sort, but I often see the build beam abused for other purposes. When attempting to outmaneuver and flank slower techs in MP creative, some players will use the build beam to orient their tech when they realize their steering isn't good enough. It gets even more abusive when you try to flank long-range artillery techs that have BS cannons or Cruise missiles and they can make a full 180 degree turn in less than a second. Of course, this is more problematic on large, open areas like the salt flats these battles take place in. The build beam also allows you to slowly but surely climb steep surfaces.
I have to say I completely forgot you could move in build beam. Maybe for this mode only, it should only right the tech and do nothing else.

- Force the player to create the techs in a workshop where you cannot load anything. You can work on as many techs as you want and have them all saved in your workshop and edit them whenever, and you can even export them! but you cannot load things from snapshots.
I think this might backfire. Yes, it would stop people from loading techs in, but they might've made something cool in campaign or creative and want to use it in this mode, yet can't because of this restriction. It could be discouraging and make them not want to play this mode.

I think it's best to make it a toggleable option when the host makes the lobby, so the mode is not strictly limited to techs made in the special workshop. Forcing players to play in a certain way usually doesn't go very well.
 
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Faffywaffy

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#5
QuackDuck said:
I think this might backfire. Yes, it would stop people from loading techs in, but they might've made something cool in campaign or creative and want to use it in this mode, yet can't because of this restriction. It could be discouraging and make them not want to play this mode.
Can't see that happening too often. I think the majority of players will want to create something new for the mode. Plus they can reverse-engineer their own techs if they want. It will be way easier than the situation I talked about in my last post because they already know how they're designed, being their rightful creator. Plus, if the aforementioned restrictions on the number of weapons or even a tech tree (where you can invest points in getting certain blocks and stuff) are a thing, then they would most likely have to design something special for the mode anyway, because none of their techs fill the bill. (I'll get into the tech tree stuff later)

The game Nimbatus had restrictions like these, because if everyone could just download a really good racing or sumo drone and use it to win all the tournaments without even trying, it would spoil the whole mode, make it pointless, and demoralize people who actually put time and effort in. Maybe this is why nobody plays sumo ranked (that and the Twitter login.)

It's really the lack of restriction that will backfire and discourage people from playing and trying, rather than the restriction itself. I can't stress this enough. I wouldn't even want the option.

That's all I really have to say about that, but onto the tech tree. Each corporation has unique parts, but there's a lot of overlap in what function those parts serve. This leads to a lot of cases where one corporation's version of something is objectively better in most situations. This means that if you want to maximize your tech's effectiveness, and you have access to every single part, you take all the best parts from each cooperation. You get blocks, BS cannons, shields and repair bubbles from Hawkeye, you get thrusters, wheels, and avalanche missiles from Venture, gyroscopes and horn thrusters from GSO, Batteries from Geocorp, and hovers and antigrav from Better Future and so on. While it's nice that every corporation has something to offer, It leads to less variety due to so many parts not being used, both aesthetically and mechanically. You'll never see anyone use a bonefied Hawkeye, GSO, or Venture tech. If you had a tech tree and allocated a limited number of points to getting certain equipment, then you would have to make certain sacrifices and specialize a little more. More specialization in techs is also great because it encourages teamplay and working together to overcome each individual tech's weaknesses which was great in the old Robocraft. I'm not entirely sure how this tech tree would be structured yet, but I think it's an interesting idea to ponder about. Also I think this would supplant the tech tree slider idea I had before.

One idea I have is the game letting you chose a faction kit to start your build off, which would significantly influence the tech's design towards one corporation (at least asthetically) and you can invest in getting stuff from other factions or getting the better parts from the one you already picked. It would include all the structural blocks.
 
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burger1113

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#6
Ooh, nice suggestion. I'd also like to add
- 30~60 seconds to bring techs in and charge them via an npc charge tower(one beside each player spawn) that disappears once the game starts.
- Option for teams to each have "the cube" tech that they need to defend from the opponents
- Players can respawn, but only within the BB left over from what they already spent. This would encourage people to use varying sizes of techs, instead of everyone going for the biggest and tankiest, slapping on everything they can within the budget.
- Anchored bases can be plotted down, but without AI(No Turrets). People could choose to have charging stations built to recoup, or selling bases to try earning some money back.
- Players get ranked from 1v1 match results

Can't see that happening too often. I think the majority of players will want to create something new for the mode. Plus they can reverse-engineer their own techs if they want.
I for one wouldn't play the mode if it had a limit of that kind. Sounds like an unnecessary limitation when players can just remember to build any tech from memory. Once we have our own image of what designs are ideal, it becomes a chore to repeat it. Someimes I like to load in multiple iterations of one tech to test which works marginally better, or load in a different tech for visual reference. Not an option in this case.
 
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Faffywaffy

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#7
burger1113 said:
Sounds like an unnecessary limitation when players can just remember to build any tech from memory. Once we have our own image of what designs are ideal, it becomes a chore to repeat it. Someimes I like to load in multiple iterations of one tech to test which works marginally better, or load in a different tech for visual reference. Not an option in this case. .
I agree that it can be hard to re-create something you've already made. My statement was a bit of a contradiction there. I see your point about wanting test different iterations, and I'm starting to realize that the restriction on loading anything is a bit overbearing. Sometimes, when attempting to improve my tech, things can go a bit awry and I want to start over again from an older version, so I get you. If you could load techs, just as long as the game verifies that it's yours, then that would be totally fine.

I still stand by the rest of my statements that no restrictions will be a huge detriment to the mode. If I entered into the official sumo championship with @Chrii_the_Vieh's Matabull, they wouldn't let me for obvious reasons. I've played Robocraft well into it's fall from grace and I remember the Robot Shop being one of the worst additions to the game, because you could just buy your way to the meta. It's a boon to the childish and impatient and in this case, you wouldn't even have to spend money.

burger1113 said:
30~60 seconds to bring techs in and charge them via an npc charge tower(one beside each player spawn) that disappears once the game starts.
Why? The techs can just spawn with their batteries full.
burger1113 said:
Option for teams to each have "the cube" tech that they need to defend from the opponents
This is an interesting idea. It would serve the same purpose that capture points do in Crossout and Robocraft in that it would force engagements and prevent players from hiding and waiting the match out. The one thing I'm afraid of though is the cube being oneshotted by cannon floaters, or what if the last two techs are barely functioning? it would take forever to destroy it. The conventional capture point would work much better in my opinion. Either way, an objective like that would be a great addition to the game and it would even bring bases and turrets into play like you mentioned, because they'd be protecting something important.

Your surplus $$BB idea reminds me of MrTwisters's "Team attrition mode," I recommend you check that out . That mechanic would be great for another mode, but I think most players will want to fight on equal terms with their opponents. Also, if I wanted to go small right off the bat, I would make a single tech out of two smaller vehicles that decouple. If the first one gets destroyed, I can take control of the one that's sitting at the base, problem solved. You could sacrifice your main tech's size and deploy a base, a turret, or even a mobile charging tech escort. The possibilities are endless.

Even among full, bonefied battle techs, size could vary and be somewhat dependant what corporation the player chose in my hypothetical tech tree idea. With some corps offering better quality blocks for a higher price. You can probably expect a Better Future-ish tech to be smaller than a GSO-ish one, yet evenly matched.
 
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