Factory, though not is not working?

JBtje

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#1
Simple factory, noting special about it. Gears and stuff on one side, resources and refined resources on the other side.

The problem: resources are not being pulled, at all.

However, when I connect the factories with the silos w/o using a "CSO down conveyer" and w/o using the "CSO up conveyer" it does pull, but it wont take the resources....

So, there are two problems I don't understand
- Why are blocks, as well as gear(!) (both sides) not being pulled
- What causes the problem that once it is pulled, and matches the fabricator requirement, it will just pass as if it wasn't ment for that fabricator?

Thanks!

ooh... what is the BB code for this?
https://viewer.mygrab.it/5b673e391137190601ee23ff87
 

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NotExactlyHero

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#2
Your setup looks like it has a bunch of unneeded stuff, although I'm no crafter.
@ZeroGravitas or some other crafting person, would you mind taking a look?
And I think this should be in Community Help, Questions, and Guides.
What causes the problem that once it is pulled, and matches the fabricator requirement, it will just pass as if it wasn't ment for that fabricator?
This might be because you have several fabricators going at once, or the resource is heading to the component factories.
 

JBtje

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#3
Community Help, Questions, and Guides.
I'm quite sure that's where I posted the question.... but it has been moved i guess.

I had a simular setup before, with multiple fabricators in a line like that: works fine. When I did the test, with this setup, I only told one fabricator to make something
 

ZeroGravitas

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#4
I'm quite sure that's where I posted the question.... but it has been moved i guess.
I don't think so, no moderator actions showing to that effect, and I approved this thread myself this morning (required on new member's first 3 posts). I've moved to "Community Help" now (from "Techs").:)

I'll take a proper look at your tech later and let you know for sure what's up. But from a quick glance at the snapshot image, it looks like it'll be a case of the conveyor line being 'too long' with too many crafting blocks attached. If the conveyor loops back around, too, that greatly compounds the problem.

These things can cause spurious resources to be sent, re-sent and apparently ignored. As can multiple Refineries and alternate routes (in parallel), set up by use of Filters on different settings (if it has any of that).
 

ZeroGravitas

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#5
OK, I took a good look and debugged it. Yeah, the main issue is that it's just too big for the puny auto-crafting AI - in terms of number of Component Factories (CFs) on a single conveyor and conveyor length itself.

Factory Fixed.png

R&D save also attached, below.

This was the largest number of CFs I could have it work reliably with. Just 8. You could probably squeeze a couple more in OK if you shortened the conveyor length (to the most distant Silos). e.g. by avoiding switch-backs and having the main Silos both sides of the feed-in conveyor line.

There's a thread here (by @Twigjack) with some detailed investigation into max possible conveyor lengths.

Note 1: also there's no advantage to more than one Refinery per conveyor line (provided it's set up like this one).

Note 2: you have to remove and re-add all the Fabricators after adding/moving any CFs, to avoid spurious resources being sent.

Note 3: I broke the loop back conveyor with a dropper-receiver pair to be on the safe side, but probably not necessary, as the loop can't been seen back around (through Silos).

Note 4
: To make it easier to modify the design while crafting, set the Pacemaker to "Pause". This way you won't get teh 1-2 second hangs each time you add/remove a block. Just one when you un-pause.

See my crafting guide for more bugs, tips and recommended designs: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1191458767
 

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JBtje

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#6
Awesome, when i'm home i'll have a go at it! Now you mention it, in my previous design I had 10 CF's....

Note 1: I have seen (in a previous design of mine (2-3 versions back)) two refineries working together. Because the first one was just too slow to get them all, and the 2nd one took care of the ones skipped. I must say that in my last previous design, this didn't work. Also interesting how you put that small conveyor next to it! Lets see what that does :D

Note 4: I was not aware of the pause :S That will speed things up!
 
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ZeroGravitas

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#7
two refineries working together
Yeah, if they are adjacent (and on the correct side of the conveyor, together), 2 can work for some things, at least. I'm not sure how far that holds, so try to stick to the one.

I'm glad you're enthused. :) Also, sorry i forgot to say: that's quite a nice base setup, overall. It is a bit of a shame that the TerraTech system can't (currently) handle big, bulk processing systems like yours, Factorio style. But parallelisation got me much more throughput (hint for future designs).
 

DrShadox

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#8
Hum , can you take ressource from Silo without a GSO Filter Conveyor ? i know you need 1 for put in it , but i've always though you need 1 too for take back...but as i've see of yours screen , you don't have one.
 

NotExactlyHero

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#9
Hum , can you take ressource from Silo without a GSO Filter Conveyor ? i know you need 1 for put in it , but i've always though you need 1 too for take back...but as i've see of yours screen , you don't have one.
You don't need filters for silos, as during crafting they'll automatically take out the resource they need, and automatically accept any resource chunks in their reach, even if on conveyors.
That was way to long for such simplicity....
 

the.nihilist

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#10
Hum , can you take ressource from Silo without a GSO Filter Conveyor ? i know you need 1 for put in it , but i've always though you need 1 too for take back...but as i've see of yours screen , you don't have one.
You not need a filter to take resources out by automation, but when you want to take out resources manually. It breaks the automation chain though …

Edit: Not need one for putting resources in either, only when you want them filtered. Else the silo takes everything passing by …
 

JBtje

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#12
Taking into account that long lines dont work, and 2 pulling lines should work faster compared to 1, I made a few changes....
@ZeroGravitas perhaps you have some feedback :p?

ooh, and how can I position the factory IN the screenshot!? I don't have the workshop package, and ingame it just kinda takes a weird picture, not even 1/6th of what I see on screen (2560*1440 screen here)
 

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Lost Ninja

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#13
Taking into account that long lines dont work, and 2 pulling lines should work faster compared to 1, I made a few changes....
@ZeroGravitas perhaps you have some feedback :p?

ooh, and how can I position the factory IN the screenshot!? I don't have the workshop package, and ingame it just kinda takes a weird picture, not even 1/6th of what I see on screen (2560*1440 screen here)
The GSO receivers have a longer range than the GC ones.

And if anyone knows how to get big techs centred in the Snapshot I'd love to know too. (It's one of those issues that annoy me and one of the reasons why I wish snap shots were just a .json with the image encoded like the save files are. (Of course then they wouldn't work as images on Twitter et al, so I understand why it was done that way...))
 

Zed

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#14
And if anyone knows how to get big techs centred in the Snapshot I'd love to know too. (It's one of those issues that annoy me and one of the reasons why I wish snap shots were just a .json with the image encoded like the save files are. (Of course then they wouldn't work as images on Twitter et al, so I understand why it was done that way...))
Typically zooming out before pressing the snapshot tech button is sufficient; in the case of "Factory V2" I also had to pan down with the camera in order to capture it in its entirety.

Factory v2 reup.png
 

ZeroGravitas

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#17
@ZeroGravitas perhaps you have some feedback :p?
I'm liking the look of it...
Seems like it should work far better. Does it? (If it works for you, you know...;):)) I see 2 parallel feed-in lines, so you know that conveyors can't split, which is good. I may be able to test some time, no promises.
 

the.nihilist

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#18
Hum , pretty sure it's the other way , GC bigger range than GSO , if it's like you said , it's a bug.
No, definitely GSO Receivers and Collectors have a wider range than GC. But GC has the higher chunk stacks on both – 10 instead of 5.
 

ZeroGravitas

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#19
OK, so yeah, it works, well done @JBtje.:)

A few little bugs with it:
  • I had to remove and re-add the Fabricators to stop it sending spurious chunks. (Although it still coped with this, because it recycled them back to storage.)
  • At least one of the Refineries will jam and fail if trying to refine a long series of chunks (e.g. for a compressed block.) They have to be on the right side of the conveyor, and the extra conveyor piece most connect back to the main line in the way I've shown before (I think).
  • 1/3 of the resources headed to storage go around the loop twice, because of the filter bug. You could pull into node silos as a buffer, and used alternator conveyors to pull back out onto the feed in conveyors. Or you could just relocate the restocking loop so that the Filter pull straight into the main silos.



There's a few Exotic dongles that can't ever come into play, too. But you seem to have found a 4 component factory (only) layout that works for the top teir blocks without jamming (which isn't a given). Still it will jam if two fabricators on that line are both making an exotic component at the same time, so I'd add a couple more CFs per fab line.

It's interesting that your storage silos have space to attach a 3rd fabricator line, too. So the manufacturing capacity could be increased further. (It'll eventually just be bottlenecked by the single scrapping line, I think.


GSO Receivers and Collectors have a wider range than GC
The GSO collectors have significantly wider collection range, yes. But the (large) GSO and GC *receivers* have such similar range that I can't tell the difference. So it's just whatever suits your look, really. Not a big deal.