[1.4.4]HE PX Tracks super weak?

burger1113

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Jan 3, 2015
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I Revisited my old tank, and it seems the PX small Tracks have VERY LITTLE TORQUE. I included the snapshot for this tech down below, and I'd say it's got to be a perfectly reasonable amount of weight for these tracks. Well? It has a hard time climbing even some shallow hills, and barely turns at all from a standstill. Back when I made this, the tracks had way more torque and way less grip, making it kinda slidey and fun. Now? it's pretty much like fish outta the water. Buff maybe?
 

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Kupcha

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Jan 30, 2020
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The tracks really do feel like they need some adjustment. Turning and climbing hills only seems to work at the max speed, which is decent, but that is it. Whats more, I replaced the HE tracks with the GSO Techa Tracks for comparison, and the improvement in maneuverability performance was absurd; the GSO tracks outperform the HE treads in every area except for maybe suspension and having roughly the same top speed, while being smaller (2 blocks for GSO treads, 6 blocks for the HE).

The HE tracks can barely turn or climb hills from a low speed, while the same number of GSO tracks can quickly do 360s from at a stop and have the torque to climb a hill starting next to 0. That said, the GSO tracks have 1000 HP with a weight of 3, while the HE tracks have 3442 HP with a weight of 4. The HE tracks also have more APs, although even doubling up on them shows little improvement.

Another issue I can find is that the GSO Techa tracks cost 1,698 BB at grade 4, while the HE tracks cost 4,980 BB at grade 1! I can definitely support the idea of bumping up the HE PX tracks in grade and power, I'm not sure the extra cost justifies the higher HP when you would never be able to outmaneuver most grade 1 wheels :D

This also brings up a point about the GSO grading system probably being outdated, being the only corp that has grade 4-5 blocks, while they clearly don't outperform all of the other corporation's lower graded blocks, but I suppose that is another discussion.
 
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Vertu

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Jun 10, 2020
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Tracks used to be the best around for making tanks. Obviously that would be a good thing, tanks use tracks all the time, simply have the right track(s) go dead so it becomes a pivot and the left track(s) turns you very effectively along that pivoting axis, no opportunity to strafe as you would expect, but it provides massive turning capabilities as you are literally PIVOTING YOUR MOVEMENT. Realistic balance from my perspective. Then an update came which stopped this. That right track will no longer go dead to become a pivot and instead become only slightly dead, ~75-95% active. This is terrible, how do you plan to turn with tank tracks like that?! You would be moving forwards more than actually turning your momentum vector. Tracks have absurd carrying capacity as they are tracks, the most carry capable type of maneuverability system, but that does not mean they should be unable to turn!

I say, revert the tracks to act the way I said, it makes sense. This method of moving would make tower tanks unviable as when you pivot to turn, you could very easily flip over. Consider that the balanced part along with making them more expensive. I would love to use them instead of making these weird wheel platforms for the "Big Daddy Wheel". >.>

Also, referring to how performance poor tracks are, that is because they have TERRABLE GRIP WHICH MAKES NO SENSE! The main method of traversing the TT hell terrain is by using thrust, a source of movement that would move you forwards when not on the ground, this is because of how many damn times you have to make a full pivot on top of a hill that has the top circumference of a mountain's peak.
In reality, tank tracks have grip pads, this is also why they get stuck in mud so easily, the pads mealy push the mud instead of the mud pushing the tank yet the tracks in TT? They are basically a conveyor edition of wheels, just a belt that goes around a loop and make contacts of the ground.

Sorry if this is a large douse of criticism. This is a topic that ticks me off in methodology. I create massive airships because massive tanks are unviable due to tracks being worthless. To me, they are just a source of Thermal Jets, aka, scrap. I don't think any random enemy uses tracks except from HE, which can never turn to face you.
 
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YaYYeeT

Turning out ESS lore at 0.0282739 words per minute
Apr 27, 2020
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Any decently sized tech basically needs like 20 of them to actually be anything near good in terms of manuverability, being an HE track it should have wayyyy more power because hawkeye stuff is really heavy.
 

minimic2002

Member
Sep 13, 2020
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I do agree that most of the treads don't have enough torque, they arent as fast as wheels as they are made to be more all terrain which I'm sure we all agree is balanced.

A small tank build like that with 4 of those really should be able to climb steep hills and ride over parts but the treads really do need a bit of tlc in the next update.

What would need changing:
1 - Higher torque
2 - more suspension

I get that with higher torque it would mean that if you don't have a decent sized tech it could flip but I think that is fair enough given that the treads are intended to carry heavier loads.
 

burger1113

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Jan 3, 2015
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What would need changing:
1 - Higher torque
2 - more suspension

I get that with higher torque it would mean that if you don't have a decent sized tech it could flip but I think that is fair enough given that the treads are intended to carry heavier loads.
Oh speaking of suspension, can we PLEASE have some dampers on wheels? Any at all would help them bottom out less and make vehicles stable. Also would help with them not flipping from too much torque or lateral traction. In real life, even suspensions with just springs don't bounce too many times from a load due to friction and all, but it seems the shafts don't have any friction at all, causing them to bounce up and down 3~4 times.
For the issue of high torque wheels flipping vehicles... Maybe the throttle could come in at a bottom of a sine wave so they don't upset techs? Not too shallow of a wave tho!
 
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Vertu

Well-Known Member
Jun 10, 2020
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Generally when it comes to bouncing, its usually because the wheel(s) are carrying a very light load and their suspension overcompensates, much like an AI tech with too much turning power, keeps over shooting, this turns it into a trampoline and one of the main tracks that have this issue is that 4x4x2 HE tank track which has a carrying capacity more than a 13mil BB tank, makes the massive tank bounce up and down all night!
 

minimic2002

Member
Sep 13, 2020
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Oh speaking of suspension, can we PLEASE have some dampers on wheels? Any at all would help them bottom out less and make vehicles stable. Also would help with them not flipping from too much torque or lateral traction. In real life, even suspensions with just springs don't bounce too many times from a load due to friction and all, but it seems the shafts don't have any friction at all, causing them to bounce up and down 3~4 times.
For the issue of high torque wheels flipping vehicles... Maybe the throttle could come in at a bottom of a sine wave so they don't upset techs? Not too shallow of a wave tho!
Better yet how about giving us some springy parts. So we can make our own custom suspensions. This would also have uses for other things as well. Could even be configurable like with a pacemaker but for how rigid the spring is.

this would be far better than just fixing a long standing issue with most of the wheels.